00:01
And then were in the town and this, like, middle aged white guy in a car driving by us just said, go back to China. And the pain, like, hit my chest immediately and I was frozen. And I think my mom and dad just acted like they didn't hear it. And I was just relieved that nothing violent or physical came out of it. But, you know, the words still really stung. And the thing with my family is, like, neither of us discussed it, neither of us acknowledged that had happened. So we kind of just let it pass by and we each dealt with it on our own. And so I think that's why I have this very, like, introspective and internal healing approach, because I'm just really so used to going into my room and journaling and managing these feelings on my own. 

 00:52
Hello and welcome to the Ally show. My name is Ali Eslamifar and I'm your host for the show. We are here with our episode nine, where we are chatting with Ashley Nguyen, someone that I met through one of our previous guests, Amanda Grover. Ashley and I, we've been chatting recently and we've been brainstorming on a few projects together. I also asked her to join us as a WePause guest coach for some of our sessions. It's been so great to get to know her. And during some of these conversations, I really felt that we should be chatting more, and I asked her to bring her story to the Ally show. I'm so excited for this conversation. 

 01:36
As Ashley and I, were talking about a wide range of topics, all the way from astrology to meditation and also to racism, a topic that is very important to me. And as an immigrant, I feel like there is a lot to be said. We're also talking about the importance of therapy and some of the steps to be taken from immigrant parents to help their kids as they're growing up to avoid tough situations. So this is actually a lot. This is a lot of topic that we talked about. And I couldn't cut any of those pieces of the conversations. So I decided to turn this episode with Ashley into two parts. In the first part, were talking about topics such as meditation and hair, stories of mental health. And in the second part, were specifically talking about astrology. 

 02:34
So we are going live with the first part of this episode today as you are tuning in with us. And then in two weeks, I will be releasing the second part of my conversation with Ashley Wynn, where we talk about astrology and an example based on my birth chart. So thank you for listening to this part and also, stay tuned for the second part coming in two weeks. As mentioned earlier, in this episode, we are talking about traumatic events that are stories of racism and bullying. If these are sensitive topics to you, please skip this episode and we are hoping to see you in the next episodes of the Ally show. Also, if you are suffering from any mental health issues or thinking that something is not right, please immediately contact your medical or mental health experts to get the help that you need. 

 03:41
If you would like to support this show, the best way to support us is by subscribing to our podcast on wherever you are listening to your podcast and by sharing that with those that you think they need such content to help with their mental health and well being. To begin all my episodes, I usually have an introduction for my guests, but this time I'm gonna skip that because Ashley has a very interesting way of describing herself. So I'm gonna skip that part and hopefully you're gonna enjoy it as much as I did. Now, without further ado, let's start our conversation with Ashley Nguyen. All right, Ashley Nguyen, how are you? Thanks so much for joining the show. I'm so excited for this conversation. 

 04:38
Yeah, I'm doing amazing today. Thank you so much, Ali, for having me here. And also, just little shout out to Amanda Grover, who was here before for introducing us too. I am really excited to be here and share my story and hope that others will resonate from it as well. 

 04:56
Yeah, well said. I also have to thank Amanda, the guest of our 8th episode. Those who are following us, they're familiar with her. She also showed up once on W, so we built a friendship. And then through that friendship, I was honored to get to know you. And we already have a session with Ashley. For those who haven't tuned in, we have a recording of her. We pause session on the Ally show. So I highly recommend for those who are not part of it, tune in. It was a very fun conversation and beautiful workshop. Everybody felt so great after going through that short 30 minutes experience. So thank you for that, Ashley. Thank you, Amanda. I think the normal question to start with is, I would love to get an intro from you for our amazing audience. 

 05:47
I want to say I'm very excited for this conversation because of this intro. 

 05:56
To begin, I've been working on introducing myself from an internal perspective versus an external one. So if you would allow me to experiment with that. So me, my name is Ashley. I am a human. I am a sensitive person who is caring, creative, kind, generous, and I feel very deeply and I really desire to transform and heal others through my own life experiences. I'm constantly on a journey to heal myself and past narratives that I've lived in so that I can step further into my light. And some things that I've gone through in life are I am a Vietnamese American. I grew up on the east coast, and my parents were immigrants from Vietnam who fled during the war. 

 06:42
So I very much have a background of growing up in an immigrant and asian american household that shaped a lot of my views and a lot of the way I limited myself in a way. And I'll kind of talk a little bit more about that later. I also currently work in tech. I am a software engineer at LinkedIn currently. And on the side, I also teach yoga. I teach meditation. I love to create meditations online for my podcast called Awaken Wellness and for insight Timer as well, because that's kind of how I got started with meditation, is by doing these guided audios online. And that was just a really accessible way for me to access meditation in the safety of my own home. 

 07:34
So, yeah, I guess going back to a lot of my background and sort of what led me from tech into meditation and yoga and the wellness space now is going back to the way I grew up in America, born and raised here in Virginia. So as a second generation, I feel that I often didn't really fit in with my peers. You know, like, I lived in Virginia, which is, as I mentioned, not a very diverse place for the most part. I also grew up in a household that had a lot of fear over survival. And this fear kind of embedded the scarcity mindset that I have that in order to feel safe and secure in America, in this society, I had to follow a predefined set of steps to succeed. 

 08:26
And these steps were to achieve well in school, focus solely on pursuits that would advance my education, go to college, leave with a degree that would ensure me a high paying salary, save all this money for the rest of my life until retirement. That was basically, this is your blueprint to success for life. And obviously, I didn't follow exactly all of these steps because in my early twenties, my identity was wrapped up entirely in what I did for a job, because I had been told my whole life, your worth is based on your achievements. Your worth is based on these external factors rather than your internal intrinsic worth. And that is a lot of the narrative that I've been working to heal to this day as I learn more about myself, learn more about my gifts and my talents and who I truly am. 

 09:19
And that's sort of why I wanted to introduce myself in that way, just to affirm, like, who I am versus these external factors that often we try to define ourselves by. So trying to go back to who I am at my core, learning that my worth was not defined by the numbers in my bank account, what status company I was working at, what was my base salary. All of this did lead me to software engineering at LinkedIn. But the journey to get here and the connections I've made through Ali and people at work and people in the asian american community and even people in the yoga space as well, it's made me realize how many. 

 10:00
How so many children of immigrants really struggle with this part of their identity and how much of that was often due to this strict upbringing to do everything you can to avoid failure. So a lot of the experiences I had early in my career, living in New York City, diving headfirst, you know, I realized that I was losing myself in the form of burnout. I felt not myself every day I showed up, and, you know, the people I was surrounded was. I like to call it fake niceties because I was around people who didn't actually uplift me, and I didn't really feel connected to my body. Like, I felt like, honestly, my soul was just nowhere to be found. 

 10:41
And so I kind of just intuitively turned to meditation and yoga to retreat to this inward, safe haven where I could get out of my head and all of these thoughts and just be in my body for once and listen to what I had to say and not what my ego or had to say or what other people were telling me I had to be. And after years of practice through meditation and yoga and learning more other self discovery modalities, I'm really into astrology as well, and human design and numerology. And I realized how powerful all of these tools were, like, collectively to help me learn who I was before all of this conditioning, before all of this, you know, all these external voices and factors telling me who I had to be. 

 11:27
And it almost, like, validated me what my natural state of being was, like, who I was trying to suppress or hide. So, yeah, that is a little bit of a long intro, but that kind of encapsulates all the little parts of me that I feel like are what make me who I am today. 

 11:49
Knowing you for this event short time, we've known each other for the past few months. That's why I was excited about this intro, because the way you look at your past and how you're seeing it as events and not things that are necessarily defining you. I think that's an interesting perspective that I heard from you before, and it's really a good waking up alarm for me to really know. Hey, on day to day basis, this is how we may get trapped into what we associate with. And in fact, let's start with the fact that I'm human and I think I love that part. I'm so happy that we are talking about these things. And then the second reason I was excited, and I'm glad you called those out, is the fact that, like how meditation and how podcasting, that's the thing I'm big at. 

 12:48
And I think I listened to some of your meditation. For those who haven't listened to, I listen to a lot of audio meditations. Let me put it this way, because that's my job. I need to do my market research to understand what are the techniques, who does it, how, and then what can I do better or differently for the farsi audience that I'm dealing with. But I listened to yours as well, and I think what's interesting about it just feels it's so natural and nothing, to your point, nothing just feels fake. And I highly recommend it to folks who love to try something new. Go to Ashley's podcast, awakened wellness and just make sure that you're listening to some of her episodes on meditations and see what's different and feel it. And just give it some time and feel it. 

 13:42
I think that was just another thing that always resonated with me. Anything you want to say about why and what's different for you when you're practicing meditation compared to what you've seen before, what makes it so different? This difference that I'm talking about, what makes it so different for you and where does that come from? 

 14:07
Yeah, so I do have to give a big shout out to my mentor. Her podcast mindful in minutes. It's a really big podcast on Spotify and Apple. And her meditations were how I got started. So I'm very heavily influenced by her, like just gentle style and nurturing style. And then I did a meditation teacher training with her as well. So she has been a very huge influence on my philosophy on meditation and the like. I guess the style that I go about it to, I think what makes it different is that I pull from my own experiences as well. I pull a lot from what I either feel or visualize during meditation. 

 14:53
And because ive inhibited this creative side of me for so long, writing meditations in this way and guiding folks through a journey using nature or using light or using the stars or the moon. That has really allowed my creativity to shine. And I think because this creativity in me has been living dormant for so long, for so many years, having this outlet now has just felt like the most fulfilling thing. And I think it's because everything I put in a meditation is done with intention. Even depending on theme of the meditation, I'll do a breath work that is in line with that theme. To start it off. Theme is around grounding and centering back to yourself. I'll start the breath work by directing the breath down into the ground so you feel your roots, you feel your tailbone and your seat anchored in. 

 15:54
And that everything I write is written with the intention of evoking a certain emotion or state of being that I want to do. And something that I have been staying really on top of, because I really love it, is by combining astrology and meditation and aligning with the new moon and the full moon. Because through my own practice, I have found that the manifestation that I do on a new moon and the release I do on a full moon is so powerful. I've seen so many shifts in my life by following the moon cycles like this. And so I thought, why don't I. Because a part of a new moon ritual is a meditation. 

 16:37
And so I thought, why don't I just create a meditation for this new moon in this certain sign, so that we can even align on this theme very intentionally, even more, too. So there was just a full moon in Libra. I talk a lot about finding balance because Libra is all about relationships, and it's a sign of the scales, peacekeeping harmony. And so I try to really tap into those parts of Libra. And then because it's a full moon, you're allowed to release the shadow parts of Libra. So, like the people pleasing, the tendency to forget oneself in the search for helping others. So that is what I think combining my love for astrology, my love for creativity, my love for visualization, and kind of following just the amount, the feeling that I want to invoke. 

 17:28
I'm always thinking about who is listening to this and what they get out of it. That's sort of what the philosophy that I derive my meditations from. So, yeah, thank you so much for asking, Ali. And I love that you are doing meditation podcast in a different language, too, because that is often so overlooked, you know, like for non english speakers. Like, everyone deserves to experience this level of peace and should have access to this level of peace. So I am really inspired that you're doing that. And I wish my Vietnamese was a little bit better in order to do meditations in Vietnamese, but that could be, you know, something that I work on eventually. 

 18:08
Yeah. Thank you. And I agree with you. And I wish you also do some Vietnamese. I would be curious to tune in. It's funny, some of my non farsi speaker friends, they tried my farsi meditations, and I got interesting feedback. So I think there's also something about the intention of listening to a meditation, regardless of the language. So I thought that was interesting. Someone just recently shared it with me. And one thing that was so bold in your philosophy and just resonated with me is this fearless approach in creativity that you have. I think oftentimes folks who are creating content, they think it has to be in a certain way to get the attention. But that authenticity in your meditation and your approach in thinking about building a meditation content, I think, makes it absolutely different. We have to be. 

 19:09
I mean, this is the basic, and the 101 benefits of doing meditation is to really feel that freedom and really feel that creativity at its best. And I think you brought it to your own approach, which is very interesting, as you were also saying. I was thinking about how I think about doing meditation and curious, like, how you think about it as well. It's like the way I do practice and guide my meditation is very similar to, I just visualize things and then I talk about them. But what's different is I had a hard time writing meditation scripts. 

 19:50
It just, to me, whenever I write it starts feeling, to me, it starts feeling a little bit of a fake or not really my feeling, whereas, like, when I just hit the record and record that, what I feel and what I see as a guide for that meditation, it feels so much more natural. I don't know if you have any thoughts on it or if it makes any sense to you. It's just honestly a tip for myself how I can improve it or how to look at this experience. 

 20:18
Yeah, that's really interesting, because I actually think I am the polar opposite. I write almost all of my meditations. I used to do, you know, free form, but I felt that while I was channeling something in the moment, I can get really lost and just kind of forget to cue the next thing. And I also feel that sometimes I, with my words, because I'm very intentional about them, I sometimes, like, linger and just kind of drift off, and I don't want to lead to have, like, a really mis. Misdirected, you know, sort of meditation in that way. So sometimes I will, like, ad lib in between cues of something that has come up, but I really, I think that there's a real benefit to writing it down because then you are more intentional with the flow of where the meditation is going. 

 21:12
Like, you kind of know the parts of it and you can just focus on the delivery in your voice to and what the tone of your voice, the way you're going to carry it, versus worrying about too much about what you're going to say. I think for me, that has just been really helpful. And I used to be a really avid writer in high school. I wrote lots of poems. I used to be a writing center tutor. So I quite enjoy the writing process of it because then it allows me to review it and edit and perfect it in a way. I've been working on trying to perfect it a little bit less, but I think writing just gives you a little bit more of a guide, too. But I think there's benefits to both. 

 21:53
Going off the cuff in free form is great for a live meditation if you're just sitting with a group of people and you don't want to have a paper in front of you and you just want to go off of the energy that you're feeling. And usually when I'm around people, I can feed off that energy and it kind of tightens up my speech. But when I'm alone and I'm just staring at my computer, I kind of need something to keep me going, you know? So those are kind of my thoughts on it. 

 22:20
There's a lot to be said about meditation. Your podcast. I'm going to come back to your podcast later in the conversation, but I think as a part of the, kind of, like, the main reason for these conversations that we are bringing to the ally show is for us to hear stories of mental health and pain. And I'm kind of curious, and that's maybe a place where we are shifting gears a little bit. What's been the story of mental health for you? Because what I've learned is, especially for folks who are more active in the mental health and wellness domain, there is definitely a deeper reason. There's. There's definitely been time or times that they felt experiences they've been through experiences that convinced them that this is an area that I should actually be creating content or helping others. 

 23:21
I'm curious, what's this story for you? What in mental health or what sort of pain you've experienced that made you be the amazing ashley you are by all the great things you're doing in mental health. 

 23:36
Oh, thank you. Yeah. I mean, you have such a good point that a lot of us are in this space for a reason, and my reason is, you know, there was a lot of pain in my childhood of not fitting in where you grew up being surrounded by white kids with, you know, barbecues and, you know, their moms have been best friends since high school, whereas my parents just arrived during high school. You know, I feel like there was this embedded community already where I grew up, and I could not insert myself into it. You know, being excluded was definitely a pain point for me as a child and as a very sensitive child, too. 

 24:16
It made me feel a certain type of way because certain kids, like, just wouldn't want to be friends with me for some reason, or I struggled to have friends that I could trust. I could really just feel kids treating me differently or hesitating to be my friend. But luckily, you know, I did have some vietnamese friends growing up, like, through my parents, to take a chance on me to just, like, hang out. But it felt like, you know, pulling one end of a stick constantly, no matter how friendly I was or how much I showed care to them. It took me a while to just accept that some kids were just not interested in getting to know me that way or just accept me, you know? And so there was a lot of pain in the community in the that way. 

 24:58
And this feeling of being constantly excluded, it made me want to have a really inclusive approach in whatever I did. So towards, like, college and high school, I actually found more of my tribe through, like, you know, being in lots of AP classes and honors classes, because a lot of my friends were either from similar backgrounds, like, their parents were also immigrants, and had this, like, high expectation on them, too. So we really bonded over that way, and I felt safe and in their presence, and, you know, it just felt more aligned when I could find people in college with a similar background to me. 

 25:33
And that's why, as I entered, like, the wellness and yoga space and realized that it isn't completely diverse, like, in terms of the teachers, in terms of the attendees, I thought, like, what if we just had more diversity in this field? Like, what? How much more of this audience, how much more of this community that came from an immigrant background or grew up with an immigrant family could benefit from this? To heal these conflicts of identity, this feeling of not fitting in, of not feeling worthy, and just teaching them to find this intrinsic worth in themselves, because that is really the key to what most humans want and seek and kind of going back to the childhood aspect that led to some harsh experiences where I felt like, you know, this world is sometimes not built for us. 

 26:21
You know, whenever my family and I traveled, we did experience, like, racism on varying levels. And that was just a really hard thing to grapple with that I didn't really, you know, come to terms with or process, really, until adulthood. And I was probably in middle school, high school at this point because, you know, in asian american culture, there is this saying where, you know, just keep quiet, keep your head down, don't cause any trouble. Because they put all this effort into coming to this country. The last thing they want to do is to be difficult. You know, they're just so grateful to be here in this country. So my parents, like, didn't really respond to anything, you know, that happened to them that was in somewhat of a racist or traumatic way. 

 27:08
Like, one situation that I can think of is back in Asheville, North Carolina, which, you know, North Carolina is very white predominant. And it's kind of ironic because my mom, when she came to the states, she started out in North Carolina, so she went to high school there, went to college there. You know, that's where she lived since she was, like, 17 years old coming from Vietnam. So I considered her, like, almost like a local. And then were in the town, and this, like, middle aged white guy in a car driving by us just said, go back to China. And the pain, like, hit my chest immediately, and I was frozen. And I think my mom and dad just acted like they didn't hear it. And I was just relieved that nothing violent or physical came out of it. 

 27:49
But, you know, the words still really stung. And the thing with my family is, like, neither of us discussed it. Neither of us acknowledged that had happened. So we kind of just let it pass by, and we each dealt with it on our own. And so I think that's why I have this very, like, introspective and internal healing approach, because I'm just really so used to going into my room and journaling and managing these feelings on my own. And I think that's part of why what I want to do is speak more openly about these instances and these occurrences and create, you know, ways for people to manage these feelings through either shifting their mindset or even learning, like, how to journal. 

 28:39
Because that in itself can help you deal with so much of the pain that we experience, you know, being a person of color in America, you know, and aside from, like, you know, the racial differences, like, going back to the, like, this is a big point on like, my issue with creativity or my, like, suppression with creativity was I had a really imaginative childhood. And I remember being, like, bullied for some pretend play I was doing. Like, this blonde girl overheard me and my friend just under the playground platform. You know, we're having the time of our lives in this make believe world. And then this girl, like, you know, overhead on the platform, basically, like, stomped on the platform and was like, making fun of us, calling us stupid and silly for, you know, having these ideas. 

 29:24
And I remember that being a really core memory to when my imagination and my creativity just shut down. And then I decided and, like, you know, aside from this instance, like, in my family, like, the creative arts weren't very respected, too, so they kind of discouraged me from diving deep into those areas of study. And so that kind of pushed me further down this road of science and logic, you know, which eventually led me to engineering because, you know, I couldn't be made fun of through that. And this memory is something that I've recently uncovered through inner child healing. And I realized, like, you know, why I suppressed my creativity. When I started the podcast, I was really hesitant to share about it. 

 30:06
And it took me a really long time to just be comfortable coming in front of the mic and speaking and just speaking my most, like, you know, being enthusiastic and sharing in that way because I was just so, like, used to being made fun of for my creative pursuits. And now I'm trying to reclaim that power that I have that is imaginative and creative. And just by writing guided meditations and yoga Nidra practices and sharing them and being more open about it and realizing that, you know, that blonde girl is not there to bully me for it anymore and I should just do whatever I want to do. So this, the podcast that I created was really born out of my, I felt, like, really a huge desire to just share creatively at that point in my life in late 2022. 

 30:57
And I felt like the podcast was just a great way to be, like, a personal passion project that honestly, like, fulfilled myself. Like, just creating it and making it just made me feel so aligned and I wasn't really caring who was listening or who was going to leave feedback on it. Like, initially, it was very much a project for myself to heal this part of myself that had hid my creativity. And, you know, I had a lot of fear leading up to the launch and sharing my voice and. 

 31:26
But in the past, like, you know, year or so, I've gotten lots of feedback, you know, from you and from other people on, like, how meditation has changed someone's view on self love, or that they finally felt self love from the first time, or that someone felt like a warm atmosphere from my voice just through a meditation, and that they finally felt connected to the moon through my new moon or full moon ritual meditations. And this feedback has felt so empowering, has really led me on the path towards creating in a different way and just starting to push myself in other ways as well. So, yeah, that is this mental pain of their creativity and through lots of, like, you know, racial disparities, racial experiences, really made me want to push for bringing this to people of color. 

 32:20
And that's why I'm so glad Amanda connected us together, because I know you're on a very similar, if not like, an overarching mission to bring. To bring this work, this feeling of peace, this feeling of healing and freedom to those who need it the most, those who have either shut down their creativity or don't know how to cope with difficult things in life. And sometimes, just while the wellness practice is developed by westerners are beautiful and so impactful, you know, like, that's how I got started. And there's very much an acknowledgement to the practice that they learn from, like, either yogic tradition or a buddhist tradition. There's always. I think there's always been lots of education around that as well, but feeling it, and, like, I think there's power in seeing it come from someone who has such a similar background to you, too. 

 33:18
And it just. I think maybe that's the difference that you were feeling as well. Ellie, in my meditations, was, it comes from this place of prior restriction. And now I can see this because of the way I think in the community, the audience that I think of as someone who's generally maybe struggling with meditation can't easily drop in their thoughts. Most humans are like this. Their thoughts just consume them, finding ways to speak to this part of them that allows them to release and surrender to the practice. 

 34:07
I mean, there's a lot to say about what you shared with us. I want to start with how things start making more sense right now. Like, I told you that I feel something different in your meditations, and you kind of, like, called it out in the end. I think that flourishing part of your creativity is something that stood out to me and, like, speaking out that creative mind, I think it's something very unique, which doesn't happen often. Again, like, because if you wanted to build your meditations with the western mindset, with the limited by the book, like a, b, c, d, steps, then you had to limit that creativity. 

 34:58
But because of the child you just described to us, that young Ashley in the high school or in the school, because of that Persona that you showed us, it's so much easier to now resonate with where that creativity comes from, where that, like, beautiful thought process comes from, that doesn't have any limit, that can actually freely speak. And I love the fact that you're finding your podcasts as a creative outlet. This is exactly like how I describe this podcast and my Farsi podcast to me. These are my creative outlet, where I have no boundaries as far as, like, what I talk about in a meditation. I mean, you're a guide. You know it better than me. You have zero limitation. 

 35:44
You can really just take a second of this experience that you have right now in nature, for example, and turn it to a beautiful, long, like, 20 minutes meditation. And it's not boring without any boundaries. And I love how it's doing it for you. And it became an outlet for you to really validate that in your child and just let it flourish. It's just amazing to see that. And the second part, and we said it over and over on this podcast, and, I mean, given my background, this is obvious topic that I care about, like, the racism that's happening even still in this country. And it's such a disappointment, to be honest, at this point. I mean, I've been in this country over ten years, and I'm so disappointed with how it's going. 

 36:36
But I'm still positive that, like, with having more people like yourself speaking up and, like, really educating everyone on this matter, hopefully in some generations, this is going to be over. I think that the type of racism that you felt is so in its own way, it's very painful and so unique where you were a child of immigrant parents, that the moment you were describing was in that car, someone saying something to your parents, that you were witnessing that as a third person, while knowing that I'm the child of this family. And I think it's a double pain, in my opinion, at least, if not more, where you know that even when I grow up, I mean, you already witnessed that pain. And what happens at that point is when I grow up, it's gonna be the same for me. 

 37:32
I mean, it's already the same for me. But when I grow up, this is not gonna go away, because as a kid, oftentimes we actually hope when we grow up, our pains or our problems are gonna go away. But when you are a kid witnessing that, you know, this is not gonna be the case for you. And I think it's such a different pain. And I really appreciate the way you describe this. Simple. It sounds like a simple story, but you described it, and you helped me imagine that moment, because it tells me why racism is such a complicated issue. And my brother also lives in the US, and now he has two kids. They're iranian, they're persian. They're going to look different forever. They're going to have their own cultural stories and, like, cultural values as they're living. 

 38:23
And I think whenever I see those kids, I'm like, how is their lives gonna be? What's gonna happen to them? This is honestly, like, one of the very few things that I'm worried about in my life is, like, how they are gonna be facing this in the future as they're growing up in this country. So that's why this topic is so top of the mind for me. And I really appreciate the way you described it. Makes me confident to pay more attention to this issue. Given what you learned from your experience through this pain and dealing with such behaviors. What advices do you have for immigrant parents? 

 39:08
Yeah, that's a really good question. And it's something I've actually been kind of thinking about when I do have kids of my own as well. And, you know, I'm not a parent yet. I'm not there yet. But what I have thought about is just having a more open, transparent dialogue with your kids and almost showing some level of vulnerability to how these racial differences impact you and what you can expect and what you can remember about yourself that, you know, you are still strong, young little kid. You can do anything you want in this country. Don't let anyone tell you that you cannot do anything because of, you know, the ethnic background that you grew up with. And just to have more of this open dialogue, like, you know, when I. 

 39:55
I probably will tell my kids this same story, like, when I was a kid, you know, people are gonna say some mean things, some hurtful things. And what my mom has somewhat reminded me in a few of these instances, whenever I came up to her upset about it, she was just like, remember who you are at your core. It was almost like a revenge success. Show them all wrong. Prove to them that you are more than just your race and that you belong here and that you are worth your value here in this country. 

 40:30
And I think for immigrant parents dealing with this, I think it's good to just acknowledge that your kids are probably going to be going to school a minority and explaining to them what that might feel like and what they can do if they ever experience hurt in that way. Like to lean on teachers, to lean on close friends, to don't give in to the words that they are spewing because they're not true. That people who have a background of hate or a energy of hate in their heart, that's what they share with the world. And if you live with the energy of love and are focused on love, then that's what you share with the world, you know? And because we grew up, I grew up buddhist. 

 41:20
And so a lot of the perspective that my parents had when it came to these things, a lot of time was just to, you know, create good karma, do good things. Good things will come to you, too. So just always try to take the high ground, even though it doesn't feel right at the moment, even though you don't, you know, you shouldn't have to. It's the other people who are inflicting this hate who should educate themselves and learn and work on themselves. But you have to protect yourself and your boundaries, and you can protect that with love by knowing that you are a being of love on this earth and that you are going to live and act purely out of the goodness of your heart and you will not sink to their level of hate. 

 42:03
So that's, you know, sort of the things that I've been simmering on. It's difficult. I feel like just one thing for immigrant parents is to talk about it and then go about it in a way that feels most right to you, that feels most aligned. 

 42:19
Given my own experience, not with immigrant parents, I mean, I didn't have immigrant parents, but in general, I think in some cultures, this concept of talking it out with your kids just doesn't exist. 

 42:34
Oh, yeah. 

 42:35
These proud cultures, whether they're because of their proud cultures, whether they never learned it, or whether they had to work three, four jobs that they didn't even have times for so many reasons, there are cultures or families that they never even talk about. Like, what goes through a mind of a kid when, let's say, they face bullying in high school, regardless of being immigrants. And I think I can relate to it. And I see even in my own therapy experience these days that, oh, my God, I never talked about this as a kid. And when I talked to my therapist, she's like, you didn't talk with your parent? I'm like, no, I. These were all things that I kept in my imagination, and I drew about it. I mean, you mentioned journaling. I did some doodling about it rather than talking about it. 

 43:28
And it's so interesting how much we carry because of not having that environment to talk about these things with our trusted people as a kid, with our parents, with a therapist that can be assigned to us, that can work with us throughout that time. I think that's how I can relate to it. I'm curious, how do you see, and especially with immigrant families, how do you see therapy at young age can help with the immigrant kids? Because how much can we expect from an immigrant parent? I mean, they haven't learned this for the past 30, 40 years. How are they going to do it for their kids rather than, well, maybe a therapist can actually chime in and help in these conversations. What's your perspective on that? 

 44:14
Yes, 100%. And that is such a good point because immigrant parents are already doing so much and there's so much of this country they don't know or they don't understand because of their experiences, too. And I actually, when I was in elementary school, I saw a guidance counselor a lot. And I think therapy for children can be really helpful because I think that's helped me in a way, like, process some of the emotions at the time. And almost like the guidance counselor was like a filter between me and my parents in a way. Like, I feel like with, you know, I'm sure it's very similar in eastern culture, like, protecting the kids, like, making sure they have a happy, free life. You know, they should be shielded from anything terrible and harmful, and they shouldn't go through anything terrible and harmful too. 

 45:04
That's a lot of, I think the motivation for immigrant parents to not talk about these things is because they don't want to trigger them or invoke, you know, these difficult topics. And then conversely, I think the children pick up on that and then are more hesitant to reach out to the parents for help or to even share an experience with that, too. I remember feeling like I couldn't tell my parents everything that was going on. I don't think they knew about, like, the bullying with the girl stomping overhead. Like, I talked to a guidance counselor about that and, like, friends. 

 45:35
And so I think having therapy for children, especially, like, within the school system too, because I remember, like, I would eat lunch in my guidance counselor's office most days because I just would so much rather talk about whatever was going on and my feelings with them there than, like, sit with some stupid kids at lunch. I feel like this is my first inclination towards, like, deep psychological conversations because it just was felt like such a safe place for me to express myself truly and get advice from someone that I trusted and to interact with an adult in a way where I could almost be seen as a fully formed human with my own thoughts, my own perspectives, my own feelings about it as well. 

 46:18
So I think therapy for children can really help them feel seen and help them find a sounding board to become a little bit more, I guess, aware of the situation and to just kind of get another perspective that isn't so filter through the lens of, you know, trauma that often immigrant parents experience that, you know, sometimes this is just the way it is and you just have to accept it, you know, and that sometimes is the messaging that we'll get, too. And so I highly recommend, like, kind of guidance counselors within schools. I know there's probably at this point, more therapy programs for children, too, and even like, externally, outside of the public school system or internally as well. Like, I hope that there are many more resources now. 

 47:07
And I know, like, even now there's more kids yoga programs, too, and even kids meditation classes that they're bringing in. So I have a lot of hope for the direction of children's mental health and especially for, like, children of immigrants or second generation, third generation children to receive this support, especially as people like me and you who are first generation, second generation, wanting to step into these roles to help the future generation younger than us, too. So I have a lot of hope there that there will be more resources than the ones I had in the early two thousands. 

 47:52
20 years ago. Probably your parents or similar immigrant parents, they couldn't have these conversations freely and loudly on a podcast or something. Maybe it started, yeah, around like 2000, but they were busy with so many other things. They had to survive the family, I'm sure. And it wasn't spoken as wide open. And I'm so happy that, like, our generation took a stance on this and we are not going to stop and we're just going to continue this conversation. We're going to continue act and create content and help each other to get rid of such problems for future generations. And I know I'm committed. I know you are as well. So it's two of us. 

 48:40
Yeah, I know we talked about in an earlier conversation that the tendency for eastern culture to just say, everything's good, put everything in a golden light, try to only convey the good things, only share about the good things, because showing any of the bad things would be weak and would cause potentially american society to dismiss us as people. But I love that your show is bringing in all these small stories of how these moments of weakness can build into a momentum of strength. It's empowered us to speak openly now, to create, to have exposure on platforms and to connect more with the community who may have been silenced in the past about the pains that they're going through. 

 49:36
And by unleashing this, I feel like there is power and momentum in sharing the parts of us that our parents or our grandparents wanted to cover up and hide because it was too, it may have yielded, you know, a form of disrespect or a form of, like, you know, oh, we'll look bad, you know, that sentiment, too. So, yeah, I just wanted to share that. 

 50:00
Yeah, thank you so much for that. And I think just to one more thing about the future and the result of really solving this problem, or to your point, part of that is accepting it, admitting the fact that these problems exist. Second part is to also know what good comes out of it, like really imagining for a second that if you and your family won't face these problems, what would happen? Or if. If you can solve these problems for yourself, what would happen? Because a lot of time we, I see it in immigrants around myself that a lot of times, because folks don't see a space for them in the bigger society, they start becoming so siloed in their own corner. Nothing wrong with it, but you're missing a point of really enjoying the multicultural country. 

 51:04
And I think that's where the world is going in general. Like, everywhere is multicultural, but in us and Canada at least, we are seeing it more than other places in the world. And by siloing yourself and only creating your corners of your cultural gathering and being limited to those, you're losing the beauty of being connected to other cultures. And it's facing those problems, facing those insecurities and trying to solve them, trying to bridge between cultures, that's going to bring a lot of joy, which is the word of today. We're going to talk about it later, which is the word of today. It's going to bring joy to your life by being connected to folks from, let's say, hey, I'm persian, you're from the asian culture. Now we bridge and we bridge through Amanda. 

 51:53
Like, these connections wouldn't exist if were not able to face these problems as they are and go through them and try to make these connections, try to actually bridge and learn from each other's culture and experiences. I think I'm encouraging folks to really think about this problem as a way that if they can solve it, those who are immigrants or they are 2nd, 1st generation, third generation. If they can solve this, the other side of the bridge is so beautiful. So that's why to me it's such a. Such an important topic because I think by solving it, we are going to have a lot more deeper diversity. I think accepting diversity is not accepting the fact that a corner culture exists. Accepting diversity is being part of those culture, experiencing them, experiencing those. 

 52:46
If I have indian friends really experiencing what it means to be in the end and really exchanging these cultures because there are so many things we can learn from each other and exchange, and over time it's going to make just a better world if we are all going to be citizens of one world. It would be so much better if the goods of every culture is combined. So the world is going to be so much more beautiful. So that's how I think about it and that's why I hope we go past these problems, solve it, face it, and just really create that embedded culture. 

 53:30
Yeah, I love this beautiful dream that you have of one world, multicultural, because there is so much depth and meaning that we could share through each other if we just, you know, saw past either stereotypes or misconceptions or, you know, formative narratives that have defined how we perceive other people. And by opening yourself up to just being curious and learning and exposing yourself, I think there's so much you could see crossover in, you know, like in as I've, you know, continued my journey as a yoga teacher, I realize how much parallel there is to my upbringing is through Buddhism and religion in that way. 

 54:18
And just some, I think some people are starting to be more open to eastern culture, like eastern medicine and just even through the healthcare system, like bringing in more breath and meditation and movement as preventative care versus leaning on drugs, medicines, pharmaceuticals to fix a quick fix a problem. You know, I think post pandemic, I have noticed a sizable shift in how we value our lives and how we value our health. And like, health is just one start to this beginning immersion of culture and passing down tradition, too. So that's why I always love to share the things that I have either learn through my childhood, like different foods or teas or practices that we did and then, you know, share it openly because now so many people are so open to the conversation because it will benefit them. 

 55:16
And people are just so much more open to realizing that, you know, ibuprofen isn't the solution to everything. Now I think people have come to a transformative shift through like, meditation and yoga, people who have practiced it are more just open to seeing the world as, like, beings to beings versus asian to persian. And that's why I think sharing more meditation with the world will help people distill down all of these mental constructs of what they believe or what they think to believe or what they had grown up to believe. And just being able to feel that all humans at their natural state are peaceful and happy, and then we can just see each other in such a different light in that way and be able to spread more culture, love, food, tradition, practices, rituals. 

 56:11
It's just so beautiful the potential that there could be for a unified earth where we all live by nature like we used to before modern society, living with the earth, living with the elements, and living with, you know, the moon and the sun and the astrological climate as well. Like, I think all of this, all of these universal teachings can show us something about this problem that we face on. You know, the, I like to say, like, kind of unawakened individuals who still like to spew hate and race. And, you know, the people who are awakened, they can change. You know, they can make shifts on this plane of being that, you know, not everything is what you see. 

 56:58
And that there's so much more depth to people than, you know, their background or their race, you know, as that's why I love that you have so many different perspectives come onto this show as well, because, like, everyone is a human that has felt pain at some point in their life. And that I feel like that's what the show kind of boils down to and how to turn that pain into inspiration for the path that you're on today or to improve your mental health or to reach a state that you thought you could never reach. 

 57:23
Thank you. And I love the fact that you looked at health as an element of culture, including food and simple practices. And I love how you see meditation and yoga as the feet at the door of getting into these beautiful spaces. I cannot tell you how much I read about, for example, sesame seeds because I have high cholesterol. And, like, I'm like, I'm not eating that much red meat. I'm not. Like, I maintain a low cholesterol diet. Like, there is definitely something with genetics, and that's why my doctor thinks. But, like, I read so much about, like, what are the things? What are the natural? They always, like sesame oil. Like, all of these come on top of the list, and they're all from asian culture and, like, so respected and so much, so beautifully used in the food. 

 58:17
And I'm like, oh my God, how did we miss it all this time? So it's just so interesting you pointed out like health and the element of the food in that. It's so interesting you also called out astrology, which I think is a good segue to the next conversation I want to have with you. And thank you so much for sharing your story and bringing that and being so honest. This was our first part of the conversation with Ashley Nguyen. I hope you enjoyed this so far and we'll see you in two weeks with the second part of our conversation. As I mentioned earlier, in the second part we are going to be talking about astrology, a topic that until this call I was not too familiar with. 

 59:06
But since this call I'm very interested in the topic and I hope by coming back to this podcast and listening to the second episode of this conversation you also feel the same way, or at least give it a shot. Thanks again for tuning in and see you soon.